some MRAs #sexist reddit.com

[They have two threads about this article, here are the highlights from the first one.]

Re: Men are more disadvantaged than women in the UK, US and most of Europe, scientists claim | Metro News

(-manatease)

We were right after all, then.

They aren't measuring most of the issues either. I wonder how the "women don't go to prison for the same crimes" thing slots in to this?

(typhonblue)
Nope. This is still biased towards women's issues. Further do they count "domestic technology" in the education category? When a household is producing 70% of a family's material wealth and living, how can you possibly say that being able to run it isn't an important skill?

(truefachman)
Actually, our "allies" at Sargon of Akkad's subreddit got pissed off at this study because it concluded that women ain't so oppressed in Saudi Arabia. And right-wingers and shitlords love to think that women are oppressed in Saudi Arabia.

(dunesfrank)
As others have noted this study only scratches the surface. For example there is nothing about MGM, boys being more likely to suffer abuse, institutional discrimination against boys in the education system; there is nothing about the feminist war on hetero male sexuality, family courts, criminal courts etc. etc.

However it's definitely a step in the right direction.

The new measure has thrown up some strange results. For instance, it rated Saudi Arabia as having a high level of ‘gender parity’, which suggests men and women live reasonably equal lives.

This is because of a 7% disadvantage for women in education and a 5% disadvantage for men in life satisfaction. But in 2016, the World Economic Forum’s Global Gender Gap Report placed Saudi Arabia at a dismal 141 out of 144 countries for gender parity.

I have long been getting downvoted for suggesting that -- as bizarre as it at first sounds -- highly patriarchal countries may be more gender egalitarian than feminist societies, because both sexes suffer discrimination in different ways. In feminist societies the discrimination (and indeed unrelenting abuse) flows mainly in one direction.

The authors of the study suggest that we need to focus on men's health in developed countries and women's education in non-developed countries. They ignore the fact that we have an educational crisis in hour own house -- discrimination against boys.

As for "health", including mental health and addiction issues (especially alcoholism) a lot of this derives from the institutional oppression of men in western countries. If I lost my kids and half my stuff and was forced to pay alimony and lost my job to an affirmative action hire etc. I might drink myself to death too.

(Wisemanner)
" highly patriarchal countries may be more gender egalitarian than feminist societies..."

I don't doubt it. In the UK, male dominated governments have always given preferential treatment to female citizens, and it should be perfectly obvious by now that female dominated governments will do the same only far more so.

(dunesfrank)

I think the research presented is an interesting way to view gender inequality, but the headline is inflammatory.

We aren't trying to take the title of ‘most disadvantaged’, it isn't a competition between social groups or between genders.

Men and women suffer in a different ways for different things. The research brings light to men's issues that perhaps aren't always considered by the wider consumer. Saying we are ‘more disadvantaged’ is a quick way to alienate the movement.

I just don't think it's fair to quantify a plethora complex social issues and present a league table of the most oppressed groups. We all have our problems, we should strive to recognise that, not compete.

There's no contest. Males are institutionally oppressed in every major area of western life. Females are institutionally privileged in every major area of western life. Feminists do themselves no favors by pretending otherwise. The longer this goes on and the worse it gets the worse the blowback will be. Either they come to grips with reality and start supporting MRA's or the far right will correct the problem for them.

Brother, come on. I fully support and recognise the issues men face. I face them too, that's exactly why I'm here. But you can't outright deny women's issues. You can't say they're privileged in every area, that just totally invalidates everything they experience as women. Our problems coexist and deserve just as much attention as each other. No more or less.

This shouldn't be about flipping the script and painting women as the oppressor and men as the oppressed. It should be about levelling the playing field for everyone.

I don't consider women "oppressors." Feminists are certainly oppressive.

And I used the word "major". Women certainly have gender based problems and disadvantages. But they are not institutionally oppressed like males, at least not in modern western nations.

(GingerRazz)

If Trump wasn't elected I'm pretty sure we'd have reached a tipping point already.

This was part of my thinking during the election. I felt like Trump had enough corruption red flags to possibly make people say enough is enough and Hillary had enough aggressive misandry to make people say enough is enough. When people asked my opinion on the election, I said the worst crisis would be us electing either of them, but the backlash might push the nation in the right direction.

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