["Why didn't you just come out and say that you'd rather humans die from burst appendixes, operable cancer, and other easily cured conditions that would otherwise be deadly, in order to satisfy your particular view of the Bible?"]
Total strawman.
The truth is that deaths from apendicitus have always been rare, and the surgery cannot be credited with saving a life. 'Operable cancer' is nonsense. Cancer surgery is a big money maker for the surgeon, but is is a bad choice for the patient. Cancer is best cured by natural means, and those means should be guided by prayer, not the PDR. Western medicine is unable to cure anything. Diabetes is a good example; they just get rich pumping them full of dangerous drugs, rather than correcting their diet and using the very effective herbal treatments.
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Cancer surgery is a big money maker for the surgeon, but is is a bad choice for the patient.
Please tell this to my great-aunt, who would have been dead a decade ago had we resorted to "prayer," but who instead opted for the surgery and has since gone on to guide another couple hundred five-year-olds through the first grade. Seriously, do tell her. I want to see her smack you upside the head.
My partner almost died from appendicitis a few years back, you dipshit. An emergency operation saved her life, no thanks to prayer and impotent gods. Your so-called "truth" is just another weak attempt at justifying your religion. Go die in a fire, imbecile.
Nevermind that surgery saved my grandmother and brother-in-law's lives when they were diagnosed with cancer. Nevermind that insulin injections keep my mother-in-law and father alive. Oh, and nevermind that when my grandfather stopped taking his meds for diabetes, he died.
Yeah, forget all that. Clearly, prayer would have fixed them all. *rolls eyes*
"Diabetes is a good example; they just get rich pumping them full of dangerous drugs, rather than correcting their diet and using the very effective herbal treatments."
Tell that to my mother, you asshole. And WHAT "very effective herbal treatments"? The only thing herbs can do for diabetes is season your fucking dinner!
Golly gee whiz! Thanks for the heads up!
And to think I was going to waste all that money on doctors and drugs! All I have to do is pay homage to some invisible deity, and my cancer will be gone! I'll take my savings and buy a Hi-Def TV! NO, a CRUISE...
More fundie idiots than regular idiots seem to ignore the fact that there are two different types of diabetes, not including gestational. I really wonder what's up with that.
Try giving a Type I herbs. Really. Except don't. I've read that cinnamon helps Type II, but probably not that much. Drugs = better.
I would have died from a ruptured appendix when I was 7 if not for surgery, you fucknut! On my behalf and on the behalf of my brother's godmother, who lost her son to brain cancer (he was about 5...) I wish you generalized cancer! May it crush your kidneys, forcing you to die poisoned by your own bodily wastes, as it did my grandmother.
If you don´t know how to spell appendix, I don´t think that you´re qualified to say the success rate of operations and how many people actually died of that illness. Tell me, who have already been operated.
You have about a 7.5% chance of contracting appendicitis in your life, slightly higher for men, slightly lower for women, slightly higher for both if you live in the North America, Europe, or Austrailia. Of those who contract it, about 10% of those who do not recieve medical treatment die, and a further 30-40% of those who do not recieve medical treatment experience life-long complications of one kind of another. Advances in medical science have actually caused the death rate from appendicitis to go down 66% since the 1920's.
Medicine does help people. Chemotherapy saves lives. Surgery saves lives. You can't cure leukimia with herbs. Hell, you can't cure leukemia at all, but science can keep the disease in check for decades now. Western medicne cures people all the time. You ever had influenza? Thank science that you are alive now, because influenze used to kill 15% of people who contracted the disease. Now, the flu is just an excuse to stay home from work for a day. The same thing goes for pneumonia, or tuberculosis, or malaria, or hepatitis, or any of thousands of other diseases. I'm willing to bet penicillian has saved your life or the life of one of your loved ones at least once or twice.
Medicine is not incompatible with the Christian faith. Many Christians believe that God cures the sick through medicine and science, but you would prefer to live in the dark ages. How arrogant of you to decide the manner in which God must help you....
Western medicine is unable to cure anything.
Really? I'd say it has a pretty good track record, for something that doesn't work. Prayer, on the other hand, hasn't been proven to do anything. And while certain herbs might help a little for some things, you sure as shit can't cure diabetes with them. So you can ask SkyDaddy for help if you like, but the rest of us will stick with what actually works.
My sister-in-law was in the hospital for almost a year because of a burst appendix. Fuckwits like you would probably say it was because the medical establishment was milking her family for all they were worth.
The problem with that theory is, we're in Canada, where health care is free.
You fail!
Some legitimate drugs are based on substances found in herbs. Aspirin, for example, was found by analyzing a folk medicine known since the Greeks: willow bark tea. But herbs often contain other harmful substances or contain the drug in a weak or harmful form. Plants make these substances for their own purposes, not ours. Willow bark tea, for example, contains salicylic acid. It's very rough on the stomach - salicylic acid is sometimes used in corn removers for its skin-dissolving properties. By synthesizing it and compounding it with a form of acetic acid, the equally effective but easier on the stomach acetylsalicylic acid (aspirin) is formed.
So the fact that herbs can work doesn't mean they're better.
I watched my dad operate and remove an aneurysm the size of an apple from a 49 year old man's aorta last week. The man has gone home already to his wife and kids.
I sincerely hope that Editor-Surveyor has an aneurysm one day, so he can see just how effective prayer and various weeds are in removing it from his speckled, self-flagellated chest.
Western medicine is unable to cure anything.
You heard it here first, folks! Antibiotics, removal of cancerous tumors before they become malignant, setting broken bones and putting them in a cast -- they're all just a great big sham.
The fact that people who receive these treatments are statistically much more likely to recover from their ailments is not because of the treatments themselves, but because the doctors are secretly praying for their patients' recovery.
Why are they praying in secret? So that the dupes will believe that Western medicine helped them when, in fact, Goddidit. This keeps the doctors in business, and paves the way for the return of Satan. That's right! Prayers are actually a sinister tool of the Devil!
I'm glad we cleared that up.
Really?
Tell that to all the devout Christians who die every year of cancer.
And my grandmother, who is dying of diabetes BECAUSE she refuses insulin.
You're out of your mind, and I'm more than happy to let you refuse medical treatment and pass away at the ripe old age of 35.
Cancer surgery is a big money maker for the surgeon
Except for in all those countries that have universal health care. If your natural remedies are so good, why does my home and native land of Canada still use surgery?
Okay. You go ahead and pray to gawd when you get fucking cancer, while I take medications for disease, then come back and talk to me.
On second thought, don't. I don't like zombies.
Um, I have diabetes (Type 1). I've had it since I was eight years old (currently eighteen) and I don't want to envoke the wrath of cap locks here, but I think I speak for everyone with diabetes when I say FUCK YOU! DIE IN A FIRE! NOW!
I've noticed the 'herbal medicine' is a big deal within the fundie world. I guess they like to think if you're ill, you pray to God and he tell you to eat that Bush behind your neighbors house and you're cured.
I'm willing to bet that herbal medicine perveyors are bigger in the Bible-belt due to this line of thought. Even Kent Hovind pushed 'natural cures',one, his "peach pit cures cancer" cure would give you a nutritious, righteous dose of Arsenic.
We would have lost one son at twelve to Diabetes, not even one Insulin plant around the great lakes and all.
"Operable cancer' is nonsense"
My uncle would like a word with you. He had tumours in his brain. After surgery several years ago, there hasn't been any trace of said cancer reappearing again. The surgeon said that the procedure in his case served as the perfect training for him & his staff, should a similar case arise in anyone else. So everyone wins. Cancer a 'big money maker for the surgeon'? We in the UK have the National Health Service. FAIL much, Editor-Surveyor?
"Western medicine is unable to cure anything"
Leprosy. Malaria. Cholera. Tetanus. To name but a few. Oh, and ever hear of the Smallpox Eradication Program from 1950-80? The disease now exists in only a few culture flasks in certain labs around the world, with ongoing debate on whether they should be kept for future virological research, or destroyed, thus making the disease extinct.
Science - 1. God - 0.
Your call, Editor-Surveyor.
So you just sit on your infected appendix then, I dare you. Ignore the pain and fever and don't go to the hospital. See where it gets you.
Also, a doctor cannot force a diabetic to lose weight and change their diet. Some people simply won't make the attempt, and in those cases there is nothing to do but put them on medication. All a doctor can do is give a patient advice. They can't make a person do anything. Blame the patient in that case, not the doctor.
The thing that scares me is he's not gonna be the one to pay the price for his beliefs, most likely, but rather a child, or a loved one.
Yup, remember your words, when you contract some of those conditions you've mentioned. Preferably everyone of them and a couple of more as a bonus.
Just keep prayin' and you'll be just fine.
Please go get cancer. I watched my own mother die a very slow, painful death at the hands of brain cancer. She prayed the whole way. She even chose a Christian setting to pass on in. And for what? Nearly a decade of slow, gradual suffering. I'm sure next you will tell me it's because she wasn't devout enough, or that she followed the wrong sect.
Here's a little word for you fundamentalists, and your culture of venom: Her suffering was abated by morphine. Her prognosis at first, was improved by surgery and chemotherapy. For half of her illness, she continued to work and lead a relatively normal life. And in the end, science still kept her comfortable through the rigors of her final burnout, rather than laying thrashing in seizures, in a pool of her own wastes.
You people are disgusting malcontents seeking only to destroy the one life people have, completely and utterly. You are scum. You are hateful, ill-bred, uneducated and deluded scum, in desperate need of psychiatric help.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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