If evolution were real, that would mean God was a liar.
So, if God were a liar, there would be NOTHING. No earth, no stars, no us, no nothing.
76 comments
"If evolution were real, that would mean God was a liar."
No. It could simply mean God is imaginary. Perhaps, those who wrote the Bible were liars, or, at best, wishful thinkers, but God's existence would have to be shown before he could be said to be a liar.
No, even if God existed and WAS a liar, the earth, stars, life and everything else could have come about through natural processes. Simiarly, if God is imaginary, everything could have appeared through natural processes. It would seem that your most important task should be proving the existence of God. Get to it, BR.
Personally,I think the universe has no beginnings and no ends,and there is an infinite amount of matter in the universe.
if you're attempting to be intellectual here, you're failing miserably.
god could have been the creator AND a liar. just because he was a liar doesn't mean he wouldn't have created...
...which is irrelevant anyway, because evolution IS real.
VulacanMak -- Jeez, dude, lighten up a little. Nobody dislikes religion more than me, but many Christians are sincere, charitable people, who in addition to wanting to save their souls, DO care about other people's earthly needs. The theology is shit, but many of the people, though deluded, are quite good people.
So, if God were a liar, there would be NOTHING. No earth, no stars, no us, no nothing. 'If Thor was a liar, there would be NO THUNDER'. Logic personified.
For the love of mike! If evolution is true, & the factual evidence is strongly for it, it neither proves or diproves the existance of god. evolutional theory deals with pure scientific fact not spirital faith.
Watch it Vulc, lest you end up as a secular fundie. Yeah, this ain't an anti-religon site, it's an anti-stupid site.
Vulcan: ... funny, your "I've been kicked in the balls just for being an atheist and nobody helped me because of that. Damn am I pissed now. Fuck you christians! I dont care how nice you may seem at first,at heart,you're ALL a bunch of selfish assholes!!!" seems a little "Pot/kettle"-ish... you must not have met that many Christians if you think they're all selfish assholes. How about calming down and trying to get to know some of them better? And perhaps stay away from the fundie-Christians... ^__^
God is pretty obviously a liar. This is established in the second chapter of Genesis.
Genesis 2:16-17:
Adam and Eve didn't die the same day that they ate the fruit, so either God is a liar or you have to throw out a literal seven-day creation. Your choice.
Also, regarding the "Personally,I think the universe has no beginnings and no ends,and there is an infinite amount of matter in the universe." bit ...
The universe has a finite amount of matter in it. As a result, there is also a finite amount of information that can exist inside of it. M-Brane "theory" posits that there are higher dimensionalities to existence, so if it is correct, there could be multiple "universes", but there would still necessarily be a finite number. "Infinite" is a word that should be used carefully when talking on cosmic scales.
If evolution were real, that would mean God was a liar.
So, if God were a liar, there would be NOTHING. No earth, no stars, no us, no nothing.
Very good Randy! In fact that's brilliant for you.
Now, let's see. Evolution is real, we know this without a doubt.
THEREFORE
God is a liar and we don't exist!
OR
God doesn't exist.
Only one of these is possible, and being as we exist...
@VulcanMak
Personally,I think the universe has no beginnings and no ends,and there is an infinite amount of matter in the universe. The universe is defnitely finite. If it had infinite mass it would collapse back into a singularity after a very short ammount of time.spacetime by massive objects. This is described by Einsteins theories of relativity.
So since there ISN'T nothing, then that means god exists and he tells the truth?
That makes no fucking sense whatsoever.
Even though, there are both sun, stars, sea and earth, and evidence that evolution is true. My conclusion is that you're an idiot who is taking as literal a book written 25000 years ago.
uuummm.... thank you, I think...
Speaking as one of the Christians on here, we're not all bad. Really.
*bzzzt* I'm sorry, your answer only applies if Creation were true.
Ergo, you're full of it and trying to justify your position by being a weasel rat used-car salesman.
VulcanMak said:
Careful, Vulcan. That's the sort of generalizing that gets you mainpaged.
A lot of our regular posters are Christian. Sandman, for example; he's one of the most prominent anti-fundies here.
You spin me right round, baby
Gigi D'agostino
Just another example of how Randy's world only makes sense when you realize that he is assuming two things as absolute, unassailable truth that requires no need for any form of proof or discussion. All of his thinking is based on the bedrock premises that A) his version of God exists, and B) everyone believes in his version of God, even if they refuse to admit it.
His entire world-view is based on these two precepts. Nothing will ever shake him on them. No amount of evidence will ever make him question his assumptions. He is closed for business.
Oddly enough, the test he has described in this post actually does more to disprove God than it does to prove God.
If you set up an all-or-nothing proposition on the Bible; if you establish the requirement that the Bible is either 100% true and accurate or it is false (because God isn't a "liar"), then you have actually disproved God. Or at least the Bible-literal version.
See, there is zero evidence that the account of creation in the Bible is true. There is a truck-load of evidence that the account of creation in the Bible is not true. Based on Randy's established standard here, that just disproved God.
If evolution were real, that would mean God was a liar.
No, it would mean the Bible is a liar - or at least highly misleading. Evolution isn't incompatible with a belief in God; whereas evolution, physics, astronomy, geology and biology all are incompatible with Genesis. Just attacking evolution is not enough to justify Genesis - you need to make increasingly bizarre arguments against all of science, such as "the speed of light drastically changes" or "Noah's Flood laid down rocks in neat layers, each with a different band of fossils in them".
Erroneous first premise, Randy.
Regarding the discussion above concerning matter, anti-matter, the size of the universe etc.: whilst discussions like this are fun, I think it's rather risky to ever claim to be certain that any of the established theories are correct, as we couldn't possibly grasp the concept of that's on the edge (and outside) of our universe.
Brother Randy meets "Dogma."
"Dogma" then makes Randy explode in a fine red mist from the rampantly subversive content and ungodly representation of God in a WOMAN in a silver bodice, tutu, plaid undies and flip-flops.
Everybody goes home happy.
God- If you eat from the tree of knowledge, you will surely die.
Adam and Eve proceed to eat it's fruit. They do not die, only realize they are nude.
Whoops. There's a lie right there from God in Genesis.
I'm really getting sick of BRandy. He pretends to represent True Christianity, he rejects any Christian who is smarter than him as being one step away from being an atheist because they actually ... shock!... understand science. He calls the Catholic Church and even the Anglican Church a heresy, encourages his victims... sorry, followers... not to read or watch anything outside the limited world of what he claims is True Christianity (ie, uberconservative Southern Baptist fundies)... encourages homeschool and home colleges and ignorance all around...
He doesn't represent anything but his own twisted views and I wish his "followers" would wake up and grow up!
He's disgusting and even has the nerve to call those who follow the Jesus of the four Gospels (the loving, caring, charitable, sharing, anti-greed, sociable, friendly, everyone-is-equal Jesus) heretics!
The Bro's logic:
If evolution is real, the Bible is wrong
The Bible is the Word of God®
God can't be wrong
Therefore, evolution is wrong.
If evolution is real, the Bible is wrong
God can't be wrong
Evolution is real, so the Bible is wrong.
Therefore, the Bible can't be the Word of God®
No, everything would still be here. You would just have to switch tactics for getting into little panties, like maybe a bag of candy.
I know it is wrong, but my first reaction was "That'd be a step up for Randy: somewhat more honest and definitely less harmful in the long term for his victims than his current modus operandi of grooming/brainwashing them."
I won't even touch the matter of Randy's "logic"...
People eat lobster, don't stone adulterers and non-virgins brides or people who don't work on Sunday or Saturday. Insects have more than six feet and people don't live more than 900 years. Snakes don't speak. By your standards, God is a liar.
Watch "Inherit the Wind." Great movie - very quotable. Also a good subtle example of how creation and evolution can be sort of be reconciled if you're not too fundie-ish about it.
Ex: How long was a day before there was a sun to measure it? Could it be a few million years?
I wonder if you can launch space vehicles from his belt buckle, he's spinning so fast.
I will personally use the word 'infinite' colloquially, imprecisely and unaplogetically all I like, as I do 'evolve' and 'theory'. Making fun of hypothesizing (don't care if it's a word) unending space and suggesting parallel universes in their stead seems hypocritical to me, jus sayin. I've read Hawking and Kaku, but Suave said this point already.
Vulc said only one thing wrong, IMO: the last sentence. But, man, in my experience with family, school, and authourity (here in Canada) the RC church has exhibited a persistent condescending sway, akin to Randy's.
No lard?! Oh, Randy, you and your suspicions 'bout one thing making what they've claimed to have done not exist......
As if you can't have an earth and stars from someone other than Gawd....
Without God's love in the lard, Randy would weigh only 130 pounds. That's apparently a bad thing becase Gawd blessed him with ZOMGTHELARD....
No lard?! Oh, Randy, you and your suspicions 'bout one thing making what they've claimed to have done not exist......
As if you can't have an earth and stars from someone other than Gawd....
Without God's love in the lard, Randy would weigh only 130 pounds. That's apparently a bad thing becase Jebus is Lard....
Here's something for you to think about.
"If evolution were real, that would mean God was a liar.
So, if God were a liar, there would be NOTHING. No earth, no stars, no us, no nothing. "
I agree.
"If evolution were real, that would mean God was a liar.
So, if God were a liar, there would be NOTHING. No earth, no stars, no us, no nothing. "
I agree.
I want to live in a world where scientific facts were regarded as such, instead of dismissed in favor of some hokey, three thousand-year old, COMPLETELY impossible creation myth.
The Christian creation story makes just as much sense as the Norse creation myth, or the Greek creation myth...or any of the other ancient Creation myths, but no one believes THOSE because they've been dismissed as being false and unrealistic.
I'm not sure I see the problem here. I mean, the gods of the pagan myths did a lot of lying and deceiving. And let's face it, Randy's idea of god bears a much closer resemblance to the whimsical, amoral and arrogant gods of the pagans than anything Jesus talked about.
Your god does not exist, therefore, he cannot be a liar.
However, for the sake of argument, lets assume for a moment that he does exist.
If evolution is not real but God created the earth to make it look like evolution is real, then wouldn't that make him deceitful? Therefore, if the earth was created by God, it has to be 4 billion years old, and allowed life to evolve naturally. Unless, of course, God is deceitful.
You fail.
1) Jesus said he was coming back within the generation of the original disciples.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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