Leading Nazis, and early 1900 influential German biologists, revealed in their writings that Darwin’s theory and publications had a major influence upon Nazi race policies. Hitler believed that the human gene pool could be improved by using selective breeding similar to how farmers breed superior cattle strains. In the formulation of their racial policies, Hitler’s government relied heavily upon Darwinism, especially the elaborations by Spencer and Haeckel. As a result, a central policy of Hitler’s administration was the development and implementation of policies designed to protect the ‘superior race’. This required at the very least preventing the ‘inferior races’ from mixing with those judged superior, in order to reduce contamination of the latter’s gene pool. The ‘superior race’ belief was based on the theory of group inequality within each species, a major presumption and requirement of Darwin’s original ‘survival of the fittest’ theory. This philosophy culminated in the ‘final solution’, the extermination of approximately six million Jews and four million other people who belonged to what German scientists judged as ‘inferior races’.
42 comments
I know I'm preaching to the choir here (irony intended)...
But, even *if* we assume On the Origin of Species directly lead to Nazi-ism, racism, and any other -isms... how does that address if it is a sound theory?
And even *if* the Modern Theory of Evolution was overturned, how would that indicate a supernatural creator (i.e. the Judeo-Christian God).
Oh, and while were at it- even *if* Obama was born in Kenya, how keep him from being born a citizen when his mom was one?
Just wonderin'
Matherly
Classic co-mingling of the existence of a tool (or theory) and mis-use of the tool (or theory).
The laws of aerodynamics aren't dependent on whether the aircraft is carrying medicine or bombs to the citizens of a city.
If the author attempted to claim that the study of chemistry is inherently evil because it inevitably leads to the production of the efficient poisons used in the holocaust, or attempted to label a belief in gravity as the evil cause of Hitler's bombs falling on Poland the ridiculous nature of the argument is laid bare.
Hitler was such a fan of Darwin that to show his appreciation, he banned Darwin's works.
...and "survival of the fittest" is associated more with social Darwinism (of which certain Nazi policies are a particularly chilling example) than with genuine Darwinian evolutionary theory.
All of which (even if it were actually true) is utterly irrelevant to the veracity of Darwin's theory. The man himself could have eaten babies while punching kittens and that too would have no bearing on whether his theory described the known facts.
Typical dishonest religionist behaviour.
Matherly, you see, this is how it works. If you can show how something was used for evil, or discredit the inventor of the theory, idea, words, whatever, bam, it's instantly untrue and therefore wrong.
but it only applies to science, and even then in vague, nothing to do with anything ways like Darwin was racist or recanted on his deathbed. It cannot however, be used against the bible even when it's something solid like bats not being birds, or an immovable earth, etc
And this was Hitler's error: he mistook Darwinian scientific theory (which is purely descriptive) for normative ethical theory (which is prescriptive). If Hitler ACTUALLY UNDERSTOOD natural selection, he wouldn't have instituted these programs; bad genes die out on their own eventually anyway. Hitler's actions were political in motive.
oh for fucks sake hitler didn't need darwin for that, he could have just looked at slavery.
slave owners in america did that all the time.
darwin said we are all related! if hitler agreed with darwin, he wouldn't have bothered with superior races or exterminating the jewish peoples.
So, Jerry Bergman's way of thinking is that religious people and potential converts to religion are all gullible and will lap up what he has written and take it to be factual, being unable to distinguish between truth and lies.
"Leading Nazis ... " name one!
"Selective breeding similar to how farmers ... " OMG farmers are all Nazis! Shut down the farms now!
Because nobody ever thought of selective breeding before 1859, and racial prejudice and anti-semitism were completely unknown to the world until Darwin published his notorious works. Yeah, that must be it.
Oh, it gets better. The whole article (posted on the site of Creation Ministries, Inc.) is just one big quote mine, and even a very cursory reading showed that the quotes are mostly misattributed, out of context or just plain irrelevant. But let us consider this quote, from Bergman himself:
If the Nazi party had fully embraced and consistently acted on the belief that all humans were descendants of Adam and Eve and equal before the creator God, as taught in both the Old Testament and New Testament Scriptures, the holocaust would never have occurred.
So, no examples could ever be found of people using those same scriptures to justify pogroms against Jews, or black slavery? Why, we had one on this very site not two days ago, did we not, that justified the same Shoah from scripture. Or perhaps we could find quotes from better known Christian thinkers ... does the name Martin Luther ring a bell? Might he not have had a somewhat greater influence on German life and thought than an English naturalist who never once said or did anything that showed any animosity toward Jews?
Hitler's banning of Darwin's books notwithstanding, misuse of a tool does not invalidate that tool.
By Jerry's logic, if a madman bashes peoples' heads in with a hammer, then carpentry and the use of hammers must ALWAYS be wrong.
Hitler's Table Talk, July 25, l942:
'From where do we get the right to believe, that from the
very beginning Man was not what he is today? Looking at
Nature tells us, that in the realm of plants and animals
changes and developments happen. But nowhere inside a
kind shows such a development as the breadth of the jump,
as Man must supposedly have made, if he has
developed from an ape-like state to what he is today.'
Christians also reject the theory of evolution.
> Leading Nazis, and early 1900 influential German biologists, revealed in their writings that Darwin’s theory and publications had a major influence upon Nazi race policies.
Yeah! And another famous text that influenced the Nazis greatly - even more directly than Darwin - was this essay called "On the Jews and Their Lies", written by some random guy called Martin Luther who apparently had some religious clout back in the day.
"similar to how farmers breed superior cattle strains"
How can you know that ages old farm breeding practice and still blame Darwin? Of course Hitler (He was well read) knew you could breed strong healthy human from strong healthy humans. Culling out the weak and undesired is also a farm practice dating back 10000 years in some areas
Hitler believed that the human gene pool could be improved by using selective breeding similar to how farmers breed superior cattle strains.
Of course. And cattle breeding was well-known for centuries before Darwin, so Darwin had nothing to do with it.
Oh, look, another moron who can't tell the difference between Social Darwinism and the theory of evolution, or that the Nazis were practicing artificial selection in trying to breed their master race, not following the concept of natural selection.
Jim Bergman, isn't that the guy pwned by PZ Myers in a debate last month? He must still be smarting from the butt hurt.
Hitler was trying to "save" some group people (that he wasn't even part of) that he thought were descended from demi-gods or something and bring back their super-human traits or something.
Evolution would mean everyone is related going far back and that his master race has flaws in areas that the other races excel at.
Hitler believed that the human gene pool could be improved by using selective breeding similar to how farmers breed superior cattle strains.
Uhh.... this didn't come from Darwin. Humans have been breeding this way for 10,000 years. Unfortunately in the last 100 years we've gotten away from breeding best to the best and have started breeding for fashion.
Oh, and I can come up with numerous quotes that show the Nazi's weren't the only ones who believed in breeding superior humans. Some are not specifically racist, but we did used to force sterilize the mentally handicapped.
History revealed that the bible and the christian belief system had a major influence upon the extermintation policy of the catholic church towards "unbelievers".
As a result the central policy of the church was, to exterminate everyone who, in their eyes, was influenced by Satan...this could be people whose christian faith differed a little bit from the official doctrine (like the Albigensans) but also people who were seen as witches and held responsible by neighbors for things like bad harvests or stillbirths.
The bible also was seen as justification by rich farmers within the USA, to import slaves en masse from Africa and to mistreat them.This resulted in the death and suffering of millions of black people.
OK, I stopped reading after the first sentence when you used the word "Nazis" when talking about Darwin's theory. Total Godwin and I'm not going to waste my time reading it.
But you know what else Nazis believed in? Gravity! They used gravity to drop bombs on Poland, France, Russia, and Britain and to hang Jews to death. That must mean that gravity is bad & evil.
So, bypassing the fact that this is total horseshit, we should denounce anything the Nazis used, or even referenced, eh?
Care to take a guess what the Nazi slogan Gott Mit Uns meant...?
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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