The whole point of parables is interpretation. (I notice many atheists are likely the kind of people who would really have trouble reading novels. Borderlining on Aspergish maybe)
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I bet there's a study that shows the opposite. Let's see, correlation is not causation, but right off the bat the US is the most religious Western country and reads the least amount of books a year of any Western country. A British study linked the propensity for being religious to people who don't understand satire. (In the US this is also linked to republicans.)
Funny, I've been reading novels from a rather early age, with no problems.
Quit projecting your stupidity and lack of reading comprehension on others.
They are only parables, simplified stories designed to illustrate a specific point. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to "interpret" them, they mean what they quite clearly and plainly say. Young children have no problem understanding them, what is your excuse?
That's right, that Dawkins guy obviously faked it to get his Oxford professorship.
(btw, I have a son diagnosed with Asperger's. H'e currently half way through volume 5 of Stephen King's Dark Tower series. He thinks the notion of your god is ridiculous. But then he uses his brain for thinking. Try it.)
I have to say, this is entirely true for me. I have enormous trouble reading fiction, as I would always prefer to read something that is about the real world. I completely accept that I am slightly impoverished in this way, but with so much out there to read, I have to pick my material and it ends up all being non-fiction.
However, I think it is extremely important to at the very least know the basic plots and concepts of the major works of fiction. Just as we can learn from history, we can also learn from the hypothetical histories and cautionary tales written by the the likes of Orwell, Kafka etc.
I wonder iff there is any truth in what this guys is saying though - not about Asperger's - just about people's attitudes to fiction.
So what you are saying is is that because Atheists don't read the bible or at least don't interperet the parables right, they must be illiterate?
Makes perfect fundie sense, but not even an iota of it to the rest of us.
Trouble reading novels? Are you nuts? Atheists can identify a novel when they see one, that it's fiction and only serve to amuse and sometimes awaken thoughts. Fundies seems to take anything printed as godgiven truth.
I read several books a week, own more than two tousand books, and I guess a few Bibles are among there somewhere.
Aspergish? You seem to be closer to it, if you can't even spell it. As far as I can see, not being able to read is not a typical symptom of Asperger's. Physical clumsiness and a lack of empathy for others are, though.
(Mr Blur)
Your son has good taste in fiction, infinitely better than that of Thomas R. A few words of caution, though: once he gets to the 7th and final book, expect a few "whiskey, tango, foxtrot" remarks to pass your son's lips. Dark Tower is a wonderful series for those who like Stephen King's material, but saying that the series ending is a bit lacking is like saying that someone who just climbed out of the deep end of a swimming pool is a bit moist.
I am currently reading "The alphabet of manliness" by Maddox.
Yes, i'm an atheist. Why am i reading it? Because it's hilarious.
I could have sworn these were the people who couldn't tell that Harry Potter and The Da Vinci Code were fiction.
And Jesus told parables, but the creation story is literal history, right?
Borderlining? That's not a real word Tommy boy. You can't just go making words up.
And, is it opposite day already? I thought we just had that.
"The whole point of parables is interpretation."
No it's not you twit. A parable is used to convey complex information in a way that allows the core point to be easily understood.
A parable, if well constructed, should never have to be "interpreted" as its meaning should be clear. Since, you know, that's the whole fucking point .
"(I notice many atheists are likely the kind of people who would really have trouble reading novels. Borderlining on Aspergish maybe)"
Aspergish? Stop making up fucking words to sound smart.
I've read more novels than you've had hot dinners, Tom. But at least I can discern that the Bible is like something by Clive Cussler: FICTION.
I've read the Bible, and it's blatantly obvious it's fiction from start to finish (with a little historical fact added, to give it at least some credibility to the ordinary peons centuries ago, so their clergy could exert control over them). After all, to quote the great Science Fiction novelist Isaac Asimov:
'Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for Atheism ever conceived.'
And I've read the Bible properly. From start to finish. No interpretation necessary. It's one of the reasons why I'm an Atheist.
Reading the sort of verbal diarhhoea I've come to expect from fundies, it's clear they haven't even cracked open a Bible in their lives. Just listened open-mouthed like the good little brain-dead, unthinking sheeple they are, to their pastor, taking in all that bullshit & propaganda he feeds them. If that's what 'Faith' & 'Belief' is, you can keep it. I prefer to think for myself, thanks.
Um, not only do I read novels, I just got a first class degree in English Literature and Creative Writing.
Based on this, I think it's safe to say that my novel reading and comprehension skills would beat Thomas R's hands down.
What was that statistic about the higher the education level, the more likely a person to be non-religious? Does he think this doesn't apply to the English Studies area of the curriculum?
Interestingly, many people with Asperger's are hyperlexic (a word meaning, essentially 'reads too much'). Hyperlexia is characterized by several things, including (but not limited to) teaching oneself (or evidently teaching oneself) to read early/learning to read exceptionally early (cases have been recorded of children as young as ten months evidently being able to read) and being, essentially, addicted to the written word.
Hyperlexia is under-studied at present, but it is often discussed as either another form of high functioning autism (which is what Asperger's Syndrome is) or a symptom of other forms of high functioning autism.
So really, people who have Asperger's are more likely to read a novel than people without. (At least, those displaying hyperlexic symptoms are--not all people with Asperger's have hyperlexic symptoms)
I've seen a few "IQ vs religion" studies. one of witch was done by a university. I forget witch university, but the study stands out.
it shows the exact opposite, it's actually pretty scary. when the people who call them selves extremely religious average in the 60-70 range...
people who claim to be complete atheists however average about 100-110.
>>"The whole point of parables is interpretation. (I notice many atheists are likely the kind of people who would really have trouble reading novels. Borderlining on Aspergish maybe)"
Hmm...seems almost like you tacked that last part on there just to establish your credibility with others on the board who might think your initial statement's too "liberal".
"Well, I kinda think you can interpret parables many different ways. Oh--um--but all atheists suck! They're so retarded! Woo, I'm not a liberal! LA LA LA!"
I read novels all the time.
Fundies on the other hand don't even bother read their own goddamn bible, in spite of their claim its the most important thing ever.
@ thewigglyone:
I can verify this, since I have Asperger's Syndrome- the hyperlexia, I mean.
I was tested in 3rd grade for my reading level and I was on a 9th grade level, but when I was re-tested in 5th grade, I was at a 13th year level (first year college). I was reading before I even got into Kindergarten.
Just out of curiosity, I went over to my little brother's (the more religious one) house and just quietly took stock of the amount of books in his house. What I found wouldn't fill two medium sized boxes, and most of it was magazines, several years out of date.
I have a library that's 20 feet square, has built-in bookshelves and goes from floor to ceiling and I have run out of room for my books. I have bookshelves in the main hallway, in my bedroom, in the front room, in my private office, and I'm still running out of room for them. I have absolutely no clue as to how many books I have- counting them all would take a few days, at least.
Not only have I read them all, I can tell you what each book contains (more or less) AND where I currently have it stored.
I have to argue that quality of reading trumps quantity. I could read about 30 Harlequin Romances in the time it would take me to read "The Idiot" but which one is going to make me ponder life?
Anyway, I've been reading mostly non-fiction lately, so yeah I haven't read a novel in a couple of years now.
@Mageapprentice:
I have 'they don't know what' (suspected AS, but no one's really sure for multiple reasons). Like you, however, I read very high level very, very early. I was never formally tested (my school didn't offer that without a fight and my mum was too busy fighting the school to test my brother who had a demonstrable learning disability), but I read the Little House on the Prairie series by Kindergarten and by Grade 5 or 6 was reading university texts for fun. My very Christian 6th grade teacher accused me of having my mother write my book reports when I handed in a 3000 word comparative essay on Watership Down vs. Tad Williams' Tailchaser's Song, with added diagrams and charts. Her reasoning? SHE had no interest in those books, so why would a child?
I learned to read at the age of 4 and have enjoyed reading ever since. In fact, being able to read & understand is why I became atheist in the first place, because I actually can understand how ridiculous the stories in the bible are.
Where does that come from?
If atheists have so much trouble reading novels, how is it that some of the best novelists are atheists? True, reading is different from writing. But people who write novels tend to read novels as well.
Mark Twain, Douglas Adams, Philip Pullman, and Terry Pratchett are (well, Adams and Twain are dead so technically were) atheists.
I regularly donate a considerable chunk of my salary to Amazon, I have more books (mostly novels) in my house than some small-town public libraries, and I've even read most of them.
As I have been doing since I was about 14.
“The whole point of parables is interpretation."
“I notice”
“Borderlining on Aspergish maybe”
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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