Ethics are detrimental to the scientific process and are based in Christian ideology, so they would be ignored.
43 comments
Oh, didnt know you could check that, my bad, fairly new to posting here still, that or i just havent paid proper attention to those things.
Yeah I'm sure he's a christian fundie now. Hey, Neo I don't think your god likes you lying and pretending!
Matthew 10:33
2 Timothy 2:12
Oooh, you got a problem. No heaven for you!
ETA: no wait, even if he's pretending, he genuinely pisses off christians as well. Makes more sense, he's a fundie of a different religion, then.
You guys... DO realize that these are the same "ethics" which prevent lifesaving research like stem cells from being explored, right? Same thing with AIDS research on a cure (they want people to be punished with diseases like AIDS for "sin"). Christianity has no place in science.
I mean, it's like people don't even pay attention to my point half the time.
@Neo
You've fallen for fundie word redefinition.
And you fell for it. Learn how fundies operate.
@Neo
This is a single sentence. As it stands, it's four undefined portions, three of which are contestable. Unless your entire post clarified things and you've just been a victim of cherry-picking, it's not really a coherent thought.
@NeoMatrix
That statement is just like all the Christian fundies who constantly insist that there is no morality apart from Christianity.
Congratulations, NeoMatrix, you're just as much of a fundie as them.
Read the fucking transcripts of the doctor's trial at Nuremberg, then we'll talk. Oh, and If you can read that shit without having nightmares, you don't get to make pronouncements about ethics...ever.
@Skide
@musical
I actually have read some of the transcripts from the doctors trials, and they are precisely why Christianity should never be involved with science. Otherwise, shit like that happens. don't blame on religion, NeoManiac?
@pharaoh
We could very easily be traveling the galaxy right now if we didn't have it.
@NeoMatrix
"@musical
What does that mean? Are you saying Nazis were a Christian group?
@Spak:
"Morality is save the dotbabies."
I wouldn't even call that accurate. Morality is not hurting people. Pro-lifers want to dominate women's lives.
@Bastethotep : Unless we're defining "Christian group" differently, I'd argue that the Nazis were a Christian group, since Hitler explicitly stated that Christianity was his main influence.
Is your name pronounced FRONK -en-steen...?! [/Gene Wilder]
@Nut-oMatrix
Theism is so powerful, pervasive, and corruptive in this worldimage
Professor Robert Winston - the UK's most eminent Gynaecologist, who has also studied Genetics - is Orthodox Jewish.
Your call.
@Demon Duck of Doom
"@Spak:
"Morality is save the dotbabies."
I wouldn't even call that accurate. Morality is not hurting people."
Morality is the word they have been using for 100 years as in "racemixing is immoral" "divorce is immoral" "women wearing pants is immoral" (not talking about Stewie here, this was a big concern in the 1930s) "Jazz is immoral" "Elvis Presley is immoral" "Madonna is immoral"
"Pro-lifers want to dominate women's lives."
That may be, but birth control/women with credit cards/women with high paying jobs are still immoral because it's against my religion.
Ethics is a secular field, it determines guidelines to behavior without reference to a giant man who lives on clouds.
Morality plays into ethics and has to a certain extent religious sources. But it isn't dependend on religion. Ethics are influenced by morality. I would strongly suggest reading Kant, since he was able to distinguish morality from religion and is still the most influental thinker when it comes to moral theory. Nearly every form of ethics bases itself around his categorial imperative (which can be simplified into the golden rule). Bioethics takes it into account and that's absolutely necessary. Science can move forward without breaking down any form of human (or even animal) dignity. Stem cell research doesn't break it, since stem cells aren't people. Experimenting on live humans or embryos which have already developed nervous systems? Whole different story. The problem of course being that we have to draw a line somewhere in a continuus process. This of course never gets you a perfect solution. Tl;dr: Stop blaming religion for everything, Neo, it makes you look as stupid as the other fundies and don't you dare remove ethics from science.
@Demon Duck of Doom"Unless we're defining "Christian group" differently, I'd argue that the Nazis were a Christian group, since Hitler explicitly stated that Christianity was his main influence."
I don't think Hitler much cared about religion at all, aside from it's usefulness and loyalty to the state. Any quotes from Hitler on the subject, I suspect, were little more than lies to get religiously minded folks to get in line behind him. As evidence, I would offer the wildly differing views on the subject amongst the Nazi leadership. Contrast Positive Christianity (The Nazi attempt to control and Nazify christianity)with Himmler's weird Nazi neo-pagan thing.
Morality is personal conduct and accountability determined by individuals. Ethics are standards set by a profession directly relating to the prevention of abuse the tools, access, status, and relationships of trust of positions within that profession which could affect the ability of that profession as a whole to do their job should someone violate them. A psychologist, for example, cannot do their job if people are afraid to divulge personal information. Therefore while the morality of simple gossip is up in the air it is unethical to share any information gleaned through that relationship with their patients.
(Ask me how I ended up a parasite, Neo.)
People who share your views are not trustworthy: There's no reason to believe you'd act in the best interests of vulnerable persons (if given the opportunity) as opposed to, say, sucking their bank accounts dry because you're too kewl for ethics. You do realise that, if you live long enough, a day will come when a major part of your personal security will rely on the basic decency of other people; when you will not be able to keep your basic rights secure solely by your own effort. And, when that day comes, you'll want to fall into the grasp of an ethical person as opposed to someone who acts entirely based on self-interest.
@Mister Spack and Demon Duck of Doom
Hitler himself was christian... sort of. Multiple documents seem to show him believing to be some kind of messiah like Jesus. Ultimately though his own leader cult clashed with christianity. Hitler wanted to supplant the religion with another one based around him.
Wow... So what about the science of investigating the relationship ships in reality that human ethics are modeling? Clearly there is something there, or else different societies would never have developed such similar laws, nor would evolution have selected to retain the ethics drives humans have so strongly.
So this implies not only that ethics ARE vital to the scientific process, but that ethics are themselves a good target for rigorous scientific (or, more accurately, mathematical and game theory) investigation.
@Anonymous Coward
I believe that to be a bit too reductionistic, game theory doesn't explain every facet of morality (but certainly has a role in describing it). Philosophy, biology and yes, even scientific theology (the study of religion mind you, not religion itself) should be included in studying it as well (and they are as far as I know).
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
To post a comment, you'll need to Sign in or Register . Making an account also allows you to claim credit for submitting quotes, and to vote on quotes and comments. You don't even need to give us your email address.
