Its ok to stone out of control children... I would have no problem if the neighborhood stoned some cocky, immature arrogant kid .. Ive had my apartment robbed, car stolen, computer taken because of juveniles.
55 comments
And if it were his parents who actually commanded him to?, remember that it's the disobedience towards parents what is reprehensible. For theft, sorry, you're only entitled to a monetary compensation.
Honestly, I'd be willing to look the other way. A disproportionate amount of crime is committed by youths under eighteen. If this would drop the numbers, make things safer, then maybe an experimental program should be started and the results studied. Besides, they don't contribute much to society anyway.
I'm no develpmental psychologist/biologist, but I can say children != adults. Teenagers (prepare to be blown away) are still children. It's possible, just maybe, they aren't always fully cognizant of all their actions and the consequences and how that affects other people, nor capable of being so. And by "possible," it's a soft way of saying "they aren't."
Guesswhat folks, part of having children exist in this world is dealing with their mistakes. Mistakes that are often anoying and unpleasent.
@Evil Deadite: A difference exists in the moral and reasoning capabilities of a six-year-old child and a sixteen-year-old teen/young adult. An enormous difference. I think teens should be held accountable for criminal actions (theft, vandalism, rape, murder) to a far greater degree in our society. They aren't children. They know when their actions harm others. They know when they commit crimes.
Xander: I have to respectfully, although only partially, disagree. A six year old and a teenager are different in their reasoning capacities, and murder and theft are different crimes. But teenagers are not adults. There have been some great articles in Scientific American, and if I wasn't so ass-lazy (and busy with my own schooling) I could look up some publications in some journals, that suggest and lend support to the idea that the chemistry of a teenager be way the hell different than at any other developmental time. Teenagers aren't always capable of understanding the consequences of their actions.
That being said, of course rape and murder need to be prosecuted to the highest level. And theft.
But discretion should be used in the prosecution of any crime that does not involve the actions of an adult.
Clearly Not?
Hmmmm.... The Holy Book comes might close to approving child sacrifice to the Deity. OK, Abraham's hand was stayed, but it shows the way the Hebrew God was thinking that he should even come up with such an idea at all.
Also, he wanted all the Ammonites (I think it was) killed, including the children. And when Saul had pity and disobeyed, he was told he would be dispossessed of the kingship of Israel. In fact he got killed, and Samuel was cock-a-hoop over it.
So, if someone breaks into my house I may just set up an altar! :-)
Instead of crying for blood, how about learning what locks and keys are for?
Actually, Renton405, you are the kind of asshole that JDs love to target. All you need to do is open your mouth to make enemies.
Rainy Day Women #12&35, indeed.
So...a child that is "out of control," rather than being disciplined, should be executed? Dude, none of us would have made it out of out teens...
If you (or the police) can catch these kids, then they can be prosecuted lawfully. There is already a range of punishments assigned to fit their crimes, and it does NOT extend to killing them (tempting though that seems when it's your stuff they've stolen -- I know).
But more importantly, how are you defining "out of control children" here? Do you include the babies who keep throwing food on the floor and kicking up a fuss at the restaurant, or those screaming-tantrum toddlers in Wal-Mart (I think there's a rule there always have to be at least two of them there!), or the 5- to 10-year-olds running up and down the aisles in the grocery stores? They're not committing crimes, but they most assuredly are "out of control children."
Dude, if we stoned every child that did this sort of thing, not only would there be way too much blood all over the place, but our species would die out in mere decades.
I'm not half as worried about "out of control children" as I am about "out of control adults," especially in positions of power.
Whine whine whine.*rolls eyes*
I'm of the opinion that if you call for children/adolescents to be stoned, you deserve to have your stuff stolen.
Yes, I'm touchy about that kind of thing.
"That's right, let's just kill. God never told us not to do that, right?"
Ol' Yahweh commanded that disobedient children be taken to the city gates and stoned to death.
Too bad no one stoned you when you were a teen Renton, maybe then you'd not have these problems....
@xander07
As long as minors don't have the rights of adults I don't think we should give them the same level of responsibility as adults.
Has anybody looked up "Renton" on other sites? I'm starting to suspect that he's an ongoing Poe.
edit: interesting...I just got an interesting overview of life for the past 7 years or so, and nothing to indicate he's a Poe. So, never mind.
Xander: a 16 (or 17) year old is not an adult for voting, inheritence, smoking, drinking or driving purposes- but they count as adults for the purposes of punishment? They owe a debt to society without society owing anything back? Interesting.
"Its ok to stone out of control children... I would have no problem if the neighborhood stoned some cocky, immature arrogant kid .. Ive had my apartment robbed, car stolen, computer taken because of juveniles."
I'm okay that you're okay with it. Really. And just so you know, I'm also okay with spattering the walls with your gray matter for stoning a "cocky, immature arrogant kid." Any kid, and most especially if said kid happens to be mine.
And I hope you're okay with that, too. :D
Hell, there have been quite a few kids I've been tempted to chuck a rock at, but I'd never actually do it. And not because of the legal consequences, either. I have this awesome little voice in my head called a 'conscience'. It tells me that killing people in a non-life-or-death situation is bad.
@Detrs
Something tells me that if this law had been in affect when you were young, we would not have been subjected to you now.
Until 14? (I live in Aus, and don't know the laws of the US) they CANNOT give back, and until 18 they require parental permission to give back (by working to get a wage). They give back to the community (thereby justifying the community's investment in education, an investment, I might add that is often payed by the child's parents through private schooling) by promising to work har to get a wage in future- they are like social capital. Hpwever, it remains not right to give someone the responsibillities of an adult (criminal punishment) without the rights (freedom of speech in school, voting, driving, inheritence ect- most of which are arbitrary and unfair). In legal terms the child has the responsibillity to obey the law without the rights to do whatever the hell they like (taken away precicely because of the obvious abuses that would occur- children having, on average a lower maturity/intelligence) within the law a normal person would have. On the one hand the child is disallowed some constitutional rights for a perfectly good reason- lack of intelligence, and on the other the child is being charged with no attention being payed to the lack of responsibillity already imposed by the other.
... to be fair, my sense of humour does tend to respond to gratuitous violence... let's face it, its funny.
of course stoning YOU would probably be funny too
Having seen the footage posted on the internet of a 17 year old girl being stoned to death in Iraq, I fail to find anything amusing in this comment. If I had the link, I would post it. It was taken from a mobile phone by someone in the crowd. It's irrelevant that they were muslims- it's the fanaticism and the belief that people who break social rules can be treated this way with impunity. It was horrendous and disgusting to see.
This person should be FORCED to watch the footage, to see the reality of a young girl's face being smashed in with rocks while they cry for their mother. This is appalling.
(PS- this was not a response to the poster above, it was a direct response to the original quote.)
"Clown", do not confuse those who would only live with the Old Covenant and process the Bible only halfway with those who have fully studied the Bible and want nothing to do with these lazy, idiotic (I apologize for using that word but felt it necessary here) fundamentalists.
"LeSigh", praise God for your having said what you did. It is the wisest answer I think anyone could have offered.
Sorry, but St. Paul still didn't do quite a good work, don't you think? Thanks to him, apostle Phillip's virgin daughters got burned as witches, after all... (It's in the Acts, can't quite remember where exactly) And that's just a tip of the iceberg.
We don't take kindly to those who don't take kindly around here!
But seriously, you're a dick and you don't have the slightest clue what you're bleating about.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
To post a comment, you'll need to Sign in or Register . Making an account also allows you to claim credit for submitting quotes, and to vote on quotes and comments. You don't even need to give us your email address.
