[Replying to the remark that we as a human species are not weak, but robust as shown by our scientific advances]

Scientific advances? Like polluting the environment and inventing cancer!?

Most politicians and religious leaders are members of secret societies. Masonry and the Vatican control the power of the world. These societies and the Vatican practice satanism. They have created international terrorism with the purpose of creating the third World War. They want to make it appear that all conflicts have been caused by conflicts and divisions between world countries and religions to establish a one world government and religion ruled by a leader who will claim to be the prophesied Messiah and to rule by divine authority. They will quote Bible verses to deceive people into thinking this is the Kingdom of God, and they will make all kind of signs and wonders. The UFO phenomenon and New Age Movement have been created for this purpose. This is the kingdom of the beast prophesied in the Bible in which all nations will gather. All people will worship the beast and all true followers of Yeshua will be persecuted. The aliens are fallen angels and hybrids, the gods worshipped by the ancient civilizations. Of course they will present great benefits to the population and they will relase new technologies and promises of peace and prosperity but do not believe them, they are only lying. This will be a fascist government, where all the people will be implanted with mind control chips and the useless eaters put to death. They have planted many lies to keep us away from the truth. God is not of any religion or denomination, because all are controlled and have substituted God because they claim to be the Truth, the Way and the Life. God is in our heart and teaches us individually, we must only understand and do what He commands. The Only Way is Yahshua the Messiah. What the majority believes is always the lie. Where the carcass is (false Christ), the vultures will gather (multitudes). <<<a href="http://www.conspiracyarchive.com/" target="_blank">http://www.conspiracyarchive.com/</a>>> <<<a href="http://www.sherryshriner.com/" target="_blank">http://www.sherryshriner.com/</a>>> <<<a href="http://www.mt.net/~watcher/" target="_blank">http://www.mt.net/~watcher/</a>>>

I was an atheist most of my life, since the age of about 12. After ditching the tooth fairy, easter bunny and santa claus, God was next in line. This was my liberation. I was of the opinion that there was no God, and that all rational people should draw the same conclusion. The only thing that could possibly budge me from my position was EVIDENCE.

Well, in September 2004, I got the evidence. Absolute proof in fact. I got it shortly after I wrote message 666 on the 3rd anniversary of 9/11. Message 666 was the culmination of my 37 years of searching for the words to describe my ideology/religion (as an atheist I was STRONGLY supporting freedom and human rights). You can read about message 666 here (I've posted it before):

<a href="http://antisubjugator.blogspot.com/2005/07/sign-of-beast.html" target="_blank">http://antisubjugator.blogspot.com/2005/07/sign-of-beast.html</a>

However, as you have probably guessed already, the proof that I was given was not independently scientifically verifiable. Which means you have no option other than to dismiss it. Or at most, you can only accept it as a theory. So anyway, here is the "theory":

We are living in a computer simulation, and God is the computer programmer. This model does not require supernatural powers. All it requires is for us to have computer technology more advanced than we have at the moment - Artificial Intelligence for starters. In a 15 billion year history, don't you think it is quite improbable that we happened to be born just when computers, nukes and the internet were invented? And also just when the USSR collapsed opening the way for worldwide freedom. And on a millenium year as well. A mere 1 million years either way would have drastically altered the simulation. Hell, even 1000 years either way would have drastically changed things.

I believe the universe is only a few decades old. God didn't sit around twiddling his thumbs for 15 billion years waiting for us to evolve. The whole thing is simulated. The whole universe is just a "virtual reality". We're probably really on a space ship, and this simulation is being run for entertainment purposes (can you think of anything better than a virtual reality to keep yourself entertained?).

And the reason God doesn't want to prove his existence is so that people will become atheists and be totally free. This is what he wants. He doesn't want to tell people how to live their lives, he wants us to make up our own rules. The only way we can be totally free is if we believe there is no God, or at least, that there's no God who's going to sit in judgement. In actual fact, we are all NATURAL ANIMALS. None of us are sinners. We all act in accordance with our genes, reacting to our environment, and using our imperfect logic skills. None of these things are our fault.

Anyway, my point is that there is definitely an intelligent entity in another dimension to us. So if you're a hard-core atheist, think again, because you're actually wrong (even though I can't scientifically prove that to your satisfaction). You need to update your model and allow for the possibility of a God, and convert to agnosticism instead. BTW, a computer simulation gives a logical reason why we can't reproduce life from raw ingredients - the properties are defined in software, which we don't have access to.

No, genocide is the killing of a group because of WHO they are, God only destroyed tribes because of what they had DONE. All the tribes around ancient Israel were semitic so it was plainly not genocide or racial in nature.

SAME THING WITH THE SPACE SHUTTLE DISASTER... GOD could have put His finger on the damaged Space Shuttle Columbia to bring it to a safe landing on earth... but He didn't because of America's national sins like sodomy! Once again, we see clearly that gays have caused Heaven to withdraw Divine blessing and protection from America!

No, as I stated ALL humans from birth have a tendency to rebel against their creator and King, that is what they [the children] were killed for, NOT because of who they were or who their parents were.

Unbelief is a moral issue because all humans know that the true God exists and deserves their worship so to deny it is being dishonest. Though of course years of denying Him can push this knowledge into the subconscious so that they can actually convince themselves that they do not believe he exists. Also the Nazis belief that allowing jews to live is immoral is just a subjective belief based on their own hatreds while the ancient hebrew belief that unbelief is immoral is based on the objective basis of God's moral character.

Now...I have never seen a UFO, but I have heard supernatural voices, in the presence of others. I have felt some powerful stuff which I suppose you may claim that any hypnotist could duplicate. I want to believe, and you want to disbelieve. Perhaps I, and most theists like me are mentally ill. If so, so be it. There is a 1% chance that the supernatural world of a Monotheistic God an an Angelic/demonic war is real, also.

Since they were destroyed for what they did, ie rebelling against the king of the universe, and preventing his representatives, ie israel, from acquiring their land. So it does not qualify as genocide. Unless you are going to say that capital punishment for all murderers is genocide of murderers.

[Replying to "The woman taken captive in war can't divorce (per Deut. 21:13-14)... Only the soldier can end the 'relationship', if he 'has no delight in her'"] Yes, the man has the primary option but she can control it by not delighting him.

Yes, it's true! Gays caused AIDS - and alot of other horrible diseases - because of their unnatural wicked acts! Every time you see a homosexual, you are looking at a killer! [insert this flaming animated GIF]

Their suffering was not unjustified, all humans are sinners and deserve death.

Did homosexual sin in America cause 9-11 and other national disasters? Yes. Here's how: Because of rampant sodomite sin, Heaven has withdrawn Divine blessing and protection from America. This allowed the Arab terrorists who attacked on 9-11 to succeed. Divine judgement and punishment of America is yet to come. Unless this nation repents, our country's fate will be the same as that of Sodom & Gomorrah!

God says that he should not mistreat her, this plainly includes rape. The humbling refers to the killing of her family. There is no rape, try again.

No, it is not irrelevant, given that according the scriptures, 'the wages of sin is death'. Therefore, God was meteing out justice on the Canaanites, Amelekites and Egyptians. Meteing out justice on evildoers is moral especially if you are the judge of the universe.

[Replying to "how does an infant 'rebel'?"]If you have ever spent any time around tiny babies you learn they can be very selfish and even manipulative.

If the Bible makes this claim for itself and the default position is 'true until proven false', we can conclude that the Bible is indeed the inerrant word of God until it is proven otherwise.

No, that is not what I am saying, they were killed for their own sins.

Fraid so, it shows that the problem is probably anti-semitism on [Jewish Bible scholar Richard] Friedman's part.

It is the responsibility of real men to care for, shelter and direct their women. Women just don't have the capacity to do what's right without the guidance of men. Too many of America's men today are fagatized, so they don't stand up like the are suppose to so as to lead society!

Second, the Bible is very clear and consistent in this message; there is no one born free from the stain of sin. In other words, there are no innocent children in the sight of God. Third, God was not punishing the people of Egypt insomuch as he was redeeming the Israelites. (A means to an end) This is another clear and consistent message found throughout the bible; any redemption of sin must be done by bloodshed (Death).

[Replying to "I am offended by the word 'fagatized'"]GOD is offended by sin. I suggest you repent of your heathen ways before GOD & ask JESUS to forgive you and cleanse you.

No, in Deut. 21:13-14, it states that if the marriage [between an Israeli soldier and a female war prisoner] does not work out she is free to go and should not be humiliated and treated like a slave. So there is no rape here.

GOD warns us clearly in the Bible not to engage in sodomy, nor adultery, nor promiscuity, nor destroy our bodies as with intravenous street drugs... These are the ways people get HIV/AIDS - almost entirely via sin. Why do you think we are given The Ten Commandments, etc in the Bible??? For all you lost heathens here: LINK to The Ten Commandments!

Anyway the argument that greymouser made that we can not trust the gospel writers to write objectively seems to fail the logic test.... Using that kind of reason one could rightly conclude that Republicans who write historical works about George Bush could not be trusted to tell the truth.

Crazy crackheads can die and go to hell, I don't have a problem with that.

Muslims had to fight those who didnt allow the peaceful spread of Islam.

[Note: The following post was not made by a "fundie" per se, but was repeatedly and independently nominated for inclusion; additionally, certain proponents of Ayn Rand's philosophy easily qualify as "secular fundies."][Arguing in support of Objectivism] "In neither of those cases, was anybody forced to do anything. You are not forced to buy from certain corporations, you have the option of starving to death and dying.

As if lack of belief is the only sin you've ever committed. And shoplifting doesn't really infringe on the rights of others, but it may infringe on the rights of the clothes being stolen...

It is one of the greatest straw men that is still being used as if it were a valid arguement. This 'wealth disparity' you are referring to is a misnomer. Consider the fact that there were 0 billionaires in 19th century America. What does this tell us? For one, it tells us that everyone was less wealthy, including the rich.

I imagine there was quite a bit of debris floating around [during Noah's flood] for insects to survive on.

Foster meaningful discussions my arse. Maybe solely between atheists, but not between atheist and theist. And of course this board will still be here without theists. Atheists just love to argue with each other about who can not believe in the existence of God the most.

People often point out that God is vindicative in the OT. The reason is because the nations whom were to be wiped out were already so evil that there was no hope of redemption. It would be much the same IF (and I say IF) the Muslim world suddenly had a collective realization that they collectively must bring down the Capitalist system of the West by any means necessary. If we as a nation saw that we could not control or predict where the suicide bombers were coming from, we as a nation may conclude that we would have no choice but to eliminate all people of that system. Is this right? Well, as evolutionists like to point out, 'Survival of the Fittest'. I am not suggesting that this belief is a reality...I am just saying 'what if?'

Because sin is a crime, and must be punished. Why is shoplifting illegal? Its a free country isn't it?

Quite simple. God created everything with age instead of waiting 5 billion years to start humanity... God condensed 5 billion years in a short period of time. As a result, the Earth appears 5 billion years old, but wasn't created that long ago. Its not like that would be a challenge for God. Now you say God is being deceptive. Its not deceptive if He tells us what He did. If you accepted God's existence and the Bible, it wouldn't be an issue. You would look at the world and say, yup, fits with what God did.

Why must creationism be excluded? It seems to be the most time-tested, logical theory of our origin that has ever existed.

Why is Christianity feared? Obviously, it's the one true faith.

Dear full blown atheist, I know there is a lot of science out there, but can atheists really fully believe that the cosmos so perfectly supports such a huge and diverse variety of life as a result of random chance?.. Doesn't it seem like this was created to work from the get go? Rather than random chance life appearing from nowhere and evolving and adapting to survive?

Anyway I backed it up with the general knowledge that transitional humans or cro-magnon man hasn't been observed in any transitional stages in our time, what the hell happened to them?

Because then atheists would actually have to consider the possibility of a superior being, and then they aren't the supreme beings of the universe anymore. Its a pride thing.

Mageth, you seem to be natorius for having a hard time with [false] analogies. Up to this point I thought you were a relatively smart guy, I mean you think therefore you are, but if you truely do not know what I was trying to illustrate regardless of my word choices then you might want to go for another swim in the primordial pool and catch up with the rest of us on this evlutionary joy ride.

The observed fact that 'kinds' do not cross over boundaries. Science supports this - try crossing a cow with an iguana.

That's okay, RufusAtticus - if I'm wrong in Jesus Christ then I wish to remain that way. You do remember Pascal's Wager, I presume? Tell you what, a hundred years from now - when it will surely be over for the two of us - let's compare notes on this ... is it a 'date'?

How many ways are there to develop wings and why did the dinosaurs develop wings, more food in the air like flying insects in other words why aren't we all flying if it was advantagous to the survival of the dinosaur or insects or bats why not for all of us?

And, if birds evolved from dinosaurs, how do you explain flying insect, flying mammals?

Can you explain how plants evolved in the first place. Was there a simple mammal cell, a simple plant cell, a simple set of cells for all the other forms of life that started at some point in time?

Has anyone taken the entire volume of 'evidence' for evolution and compiled it? I think if they had and then threw out anything that has not been scientificaly 'proven' (the assumption stuff) they would probably end up with nothing.

I'll try to jumpstart your thread by stating that cro-magnon man didn't exist, and the fact that remote places do not contain cro-mags or transitional humans is decent evidence that they never existed and a comparison would be pure folly and if money were spent, a waste of money.

Here's my logic. If God exists then there must be natural laws(which He created and are easily observable) and supernatural laws(which He also created, but rarely play a part in the natural world). If God does not exist then, at no point in time will there be a 'law' in which science cannot explain.

When i read the Quran i know as 1 and half billion muslims know that it cant be made by a man. There are many scientific miracles in the Quran. There are many prophesis in the Quran. There is no contradictories in the Quran. From Prophet Muhammed life.You know he is a prophet.He never punished or killed someone without right.Never started a war against anyone. These are things that i can think of right now.